We’re Heading for a Covid Vaccine Civil War

26 Oct 2021

CLAY: In the state of Florida also a lot of awesome things going on. Covid cases have hit the low for the entirety of the nation, lowest rate of covid infection in Florida. A lot of you don’t know that because the mainstream media won’t cover it. The increase in cases — big story — the reality as the cases plummet not anywhere near that same level. And vaccine mandates are coming under siege because Florida has managed to have the lowest covid rate in the entire country without vaccine mandates and without any mask mandates. Florida’s own Surgeon General, he happens to be a Harvard med graduate, Doctor Joseph Ladapo, he spoke and said vaccine mandates don’t create safe workplaces. That, in fact, he says is a lie. This is what he had to say on the issue. Listen.

LADAPO: I’ve heard some leaders say things like, you know, we’ll create safe workplaces by mandating these vaccines. Well, they’re really decoupled because the infections can still happen whether people are vaccinated or not. I mean, that’s very obvious, you know, and you remember these people were also telling you that all these breakthrough infections were rare. Well, they’re obviously not rare.

In fact, they’re common. And so that’s the truth. So this idea that the vaccine mandates are needed to create safe workplaces is a complete lie. It’s continued to be repeated. And you should know that it’s not at all backed up by science. In fact, the science says something that’s completely the opposite.

BUCK: Clay, this is remarkable because this goes against the primary narrative that they used to get so much of the policy in place for the last couple of months, which was essentially even if — even if it’s possible for you to get infected, it’s so rare that we should essentially treat those who are vaccinated as though they’re good to go, in terms of spreading the virus. Forget about hospitalization and death and all that data for right now. In terms of their ability to spread the virus. But what was really going on was while the virus was, you know, ripping through this country over the summertime and it was clear from the data that there was actually a serious drop-off in the protection of the vaccines, they kept saying, “Oh, but, you know, there’s” — what was it? I think one in 5,000, Joe Biden said, was that remember? That was in his speech back in August, a one in 5,000 chance of a breakthrough case.

And he was really playing with the statistics in a way to make it seem like it was much less likely than it is. I know personally multiple people that were fully vaccinated had breakthrough cases. Didn’t get super sick, but the point is the vaccine obviously didn’t stop them from getting sick and wouldn’t stop them once they’re sick from spreading it to other people. So we’ve been once again forced to go along with policies based upon data that turned out to not be or I should say conclusions that when you look at the data turned out to not be accurate. I mean, it’s one thing if they want to say we’re going to push this because we’re looking at risk parameters and all the rest, but they said no, you’re not going to get it or spread it. That turned the to not be true and it’s even less true than they say. And that’s where I say this is so important because the protection from the vaccine goes down. We all know this. And this is why they’re pushing the boosters. So they kept saying, oh, no, you’re still protected, you’re still protected. Not so much anymore if you got it six months ago.

CLAY: No doubt. And how much different would our national discourse be, by the way — credit again to the state of Florida for putting a Surgeon General of the state out there who is being honest and discussing this case with a larger degree of nuance, that is the covid infections, vaccine mandates, all of that, than most of the public officials that we hear from on a regular basis whether it’s Ronna McDaniel at the CDC, whether it’s Dr. Fauci at NIH. Listen to, again, this is Florida’s own Surgeon General, Dr. Joseph Ladapo, listen to him talk about one of the reasons people are uncomfortable with vaccines is the climate of dishonesty under which the Biden administration has been trying to sell them.

LADAPO: Part of the reason that people are not comfortable, some people are not comfortable with these vaccines is it because the climate of dishonesty, scientific dishonesty about the science, right, whether it’s natural immunity, denial of that in the face of data, or in the case of the vaccines, open, honest discussions about both the effectiveness and safety. There’s been dishonesty around that. The reality of how safe these vaccines are is absolutely not public. Healthy people who’ve had adverse reactions after the vaccine, there’s been a concerted effort to prevent these types of stories, these experiences from receiving the attention that they obviously should receive.

CLAY: It’s so utterly true.

BUCK: Yeah, I mean, Clay, it’s utterly true that you can have doctors come forward, and remember it’s not even saying necessarily that Fauci and the rest are wrong. We can go back to the Great Barrington Declaration where you had thousands of doctors and scientists who are saying, yes, covid is very dangerous to people, especially in certain categories, you know, age and comorbidities. We’re taking this virus very simply but we simple don’t have the tools and society cannot and should not bear the burden of pretending like we can stop this or control this; so we have a different risk tolerance. That was what they were trying to say. We have to allow for the fact that society must move forward the same way we have for our entire lives with flu and other respiratory viruses. This was worse than flu.

We’re all understanding and admitting that based on the numbers. But that doesn’t mean that you should have a entirely different approach to it or largely different approach to it. And I think what we’re seeing, Clay, is people have led themselves now to believe that only, with enough boosters we’ll get to this end state of no more covid. And they keep comparing vaccination, they do this all the time now to the MMR vaccine, the covid vaccine to those different shots that people get. And I think it’s really important people to know ’cause I’ve been saying here, we’ve been saying that measles has one in a thousand mortality for children which is far higher than covid. Beyond that, measles does not mutate in a way that allows it to evade immunity. They’ve done studies on this. There’s research on this. So when you get their shot, when you have measles immunity, you’re good, you don’t get measles.

You could have covid-19 immunity and get covid-2022 or whatever they’re gonna call it, right? And this is why the policy of trying to play catch-up all the time and make people get the shot and make people get the shot what we’re really dealing with now is a paradigm that’s much more similar to seasonal influenza where you get the shot, it will give you some immunity, should be helpful, but should we force everybody forever to live their lives this way? I mean, I’m walking around the Vegas casino floors, I don’t really gamble. It’s not my thing. But I have to walk through them, you know, to get anywhere. And I’m getting shouted at to put my mask on every day ’cause I refuse to.

CLAY: Well, and what’s crazy about this, Buck, and I wrote about this this morning on my anonymous mailbag on the OutKick ’cause I got asked by a family guy out there got a kindergartener how big is the battle gonna be over mandatory vaccines? I think it’s gonna make the mask battle look like just a total water gunfight. Like we’re headed for I think a vaccine civil war over covid. And to your point on the larger context here, seasonal flu kills more kids than covid does. We’ve never mandated the flu shot, ever, to go to school. This is about analyzing risk and behaving in an intelligent fashion, and, frankly, anyone who’s saying a 5-year-old needs to get a covid vaccine shot is behaving I think in a crazy manner and not analyzing risk in a legitimate fashion.


BECERRA: Right now requiring workers to be vaccinated is something you’re seeing at the public — by the public sector and the private sector. We need to get out of this pandemic, and everyone has to be part of that. If you want to do stuff in public, if you want to do stuff with others, you gotta be part of the team, and part of the team means you have to be safe and let others be safe around you. You can’t just be selfish.

BUCK: Welcome back to Clay and Buck show. I know you hear that, you say, what? That was HHS Secretary Becerra on vaccine mandates. They’re pushing harder and harder. They’re going to be coming for your kids with the shots in schools, meaning that if you want your child to be able to enroll in school in New York and California and a number of states they’re gonna say you gotta get the shot even though as we have told you so many times, and it’s important, got about a one in a million shot, that’s right, one in a million of a child who is otherwise healthy getting covid and dying from it. It is a lightning strike situation, but you’re supposed to walk around and be terrified of it. And a lot of woke libs do exactly that. They walk around and they are constantly frightened about themselves getting covid even if they’re young relatively speaking and at low risk, they’re terrified for their children, and they won’t stop with the mandates. In fact, what’s going to happen here is they’re going to make this an annual, a yearly thing, most likely.

Clay and I have been telling you this because we know who and what we are dealing with. We understand the thinking of the other side. We’ve seen how they have shifted their arguments, they’ve been wrong time and time again, and then they just change what the goal is to suit their continued neuroses and demands for even greater power. The Moderna chairman, Noubar Afeyan, I’m not sure how to say it, he was just on TV earlier today discussing how the covid booster as far as Moderna is concerned is probably gonna be a bit like, oh, you guessed it, the flu vaccine, or the flu shot. Meaning that it’s something that you get every year and in fact they’re looking at, and this is where you start to think about the business aspects of this and the way that maybe the profit motive, the tens of billions. t

That’s right, billions of dollars at stake here might start to factor in some of these public health decisions, Clay, the chief of Moderna saying, you know what we might do guys just to make this all so helpful, maybe we’ll put the flu shot in with the covid shot so you get a two-for-one and that way maybe it won’t seem so weird to people that we’re making them now get the shot because what we are facing now is covid is the flu except a different virus with different risk parameters to it but it’s going to be treated like the flu except you have to get the shot, so to speak, not that it’s a option to opt out of it. That’s what we’re heading for.

CLAY: We told you this was coming. We told you on this show, we said where this is headed is all of these, again, I’m saying covid vaccine in quotation marks because a yearly shot is not a vaccine by any measure that I’ve ever seen it referred to in the past. Would you agree boosters are different. Yes, you can have to get a booster at a certain age. Your kids if you have young kids like I did, you take ’em in, they have to get booster shots for the measles, mumps, rubella, all of that. But I don’t recall any virus that we have ever said, hey, we got a vaccine, but in order to get that vaccine you have to get it every single year, and it’s mandatory for you to get this in order to be able to work. The flu shot is the analogy here, Buck.

I can’t remember any school district, any employer, any job requiring, you can correct me if I’m wrong. Maybe there’s somebody out there who’s had to get the flu shot and prove they got the flu shot in order to be able to be employed, but I can’t remember ever seeing it. And certainly it hasn’t ever been included as a part of the overall mandate in order for you to go to school or worker. Now, I’m fine if you want to get the flu shot. Certainly if you are elderly it makes sense. I even got the flu shot back when I did local radio, they used to encourage people to get the flu shot, and they would come to our studio or we would do a show live from Kroger, and they would give us a flu shot during the course of the show. I’m not opposed to the flu shot.

I’ve gotten ’em before. I may well get them again into the future. But the idea that it should be mandatory from the government from your job, from your school district for people to get a yearly covid shot is madness. And, oh, by the way, the flu shot is only around 50% effective, and a lot of times they’re not even sure which variation, which variant of the flu is gonna be prevalent in any given year.

BUCK: So in the same way that you have to cut through the spin and the PR from the Fauciites and the way that all this has come down from the left health apparatus and the federal bureaucracy, you look at something like, why do we need boosters? We need boosters because the vaccines do not continue to be effective enough over a relatively short period of time, full stop. That is reality, right? We know this now. They don’t say it that way because they don’t like that, that doesn’t really fit into the “everybody better got the shot, everybody better get the shot so they can get another shot in six months and another shot after that.” And that then brings me to the next conclusion, which is when they’re talking about an annual shot for covid, Clay, that’s a recognition among the people who study this, research this more than anybody. I mean Big Pharma has far more resources than I can assure you the Fauciite labs studying this at the CDC and the NIH do. And what they’re telling everybody is this is going to be around forever.

What we’ve been saying all along is that this notion of like lockdowns and masks and all this stuff, eventually we’re just gonna have to see that this is now a thing that’s out there that’s not going away, the same way that we have other respiratory viruses that are seasonal. Yes, it’s nastier than the flu but we’re also getting more and more natural immunity which is durable and lasting. They don’t know how long. I think we’ll see that there are people who were probably on the younger end of the spectrum who get infected with covid recover and are protected for years. So it won’t be as bad in the future, hopefully, I’m praying this is right, but you can see how this all does up, it won’t be as bad going forward as it has been because of natural immunity. And the vaccines will be effectively therapeutics the way they are like the flu for people at high risk.

But all the rest of this stuff, then, all the masking and the distancing and the give me the little packet of hand sanitizer when I get on the plane which may be dumbest thing, right? I’m on a plane, I’m breathing in the air, I’m gonna do the hand sanitizer on my hand? Maybe for cleanliness purposes if people think, but I also think that stuff doesn’t really do all that much. We gotta get rid of all this. This is all, as you always say, is pandemic covid theater. We gotta get rid of all this stuff. We know the reality here. Get the shots if you’re at risk. And they gotta stop with this mandate madness because, you’re right, it’s gonna be about the kids in schools. And now imagine how people would feel, I mean, Clay, you’re a dad. How would you feel about being told you had to get your kids the MMR vaccine every year? Every year.

CLAY: Well, it’s perfectly said, right? I mean and that’s why I said, you thought that the battle over masks was a civil war? It’s gonna make this battle look like a water gunfight. I mean, the requirement that the kids get the covid vaccine is going to be an epic battle royale in many different states, in many different school districts out there, and the fight is significant because we’re requiring kids every year to get a vaccine for something that has virtually zero danger to them. I mean, that’s the truth. Now, if you’re a parent and you want your kid to get the covid vaccine, then that’s totally your right. If you want to get the covid shot every year for the next 30 years as they move into adulthood, next 20 years, however long you make that choice, that’s your right, but we’ve never mandated the flu shot. To my knowledge no school has ever maintained the flu shot as a condition of going to school. And now we’re gonna mandate a yearly covid vaccine? Again, it’s a covid shot. It’s not a covid vaccine.

BUCK: I mean, mRNA vaccine technology is being used in a way that is new. We all know that. And now we’re heading for a future where it’s just gonna be a yearly thing that you do to your body, your immune system. We ask questions like what are the long-term studies of that, Clay, and we both know the answer is there are no long-term studies of that. The answers they don’t know. And, you know, in an extreme situation, an emergency, you know, some people say, okay, we need to get this, and it’s, you and I sit here, and I think one of the things that at least keeps some of the loony left off our backs is, your parents vaccinated. My parents vaccinated. I told, telling your dad to get got a the booster gonna go get in next couple weeks. We’re not crazy people here. We want everyone to be healthy and safe and live long, good lives and everything else. We just see the reality and see where you’re being lied to and tell you about it or see where they’re exaggerating or they’re being dishonest or they’re calling it horse dewormer. That’s all we’re doing. And yet there are so few who are willing to do that, Clay.

CLAY: Yeah. And all we’re really doing is saying the risk levels are different based on your age. My parents got the booster, they got the vaccine. It makes sense. They’re over 75 years old. My 5-year-old, now 7-year-old, just turned 7, first grader. Doesn’t make any sense for him to do that. Your 5-year-old out there who’s in kindergarten, it doesn’t make any sense. The age range restrictions are different for an 85-year-old and people out there like, well, they spread it. The reference data does not respect the argument that they are primary conveyors of this virus. So that argument also doesn’t hold water.

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